Thursday, February 28, 2008

40 on 40

This April will mark the 40th anniversary of the death of Martin Luther King Jr. It’s been forty years since that tragic day in Memphis of which I still recall very vividly.

Forty years, so what has happened since then? Let’s us see, well outside of more folk like me on television and in movies, albeit still in the roles of tricksters and clowns, fewer African American farmers, lower literacy rates and easier access to guns, credit cards, and strip malls (and clubs), I would suggest very little.

This strikes me as strange, for although I can see some movement toward his vision, it seems wit each step we progress forward, we are either kicked back or worse, kicking ourselves back three or four more steps. Yes, we have seen four or five Presidential candidacies from the likes of Jackson, Chisom and recently, Obama. But outside of that, I can’t place my hand on any one tangible accomplishment other than the vote (BTW which my granny said they didn’t die and bleed in the streets for – in her words it was justice and liberty). She as the men in my family always told me that if you have to ask for freedom, then one must question if they are actually free.

I mean, never was this so clear, the divisiveness when I accidentally ran across the forum annual held by Tavis Smiley last week. Dr. Cornel West and another member of the panel ripped him apart, for less than petty reasons, one being that he had the audacity to announce his candidacy on the same weekend of the forum. They even had a problem with him announcing his candidacy at the birthplace of Abraham Lincoln, Springfield, Illinois. Never mind that it makes good sense, being that Senator Obama is the U.S. Senator from the State of Illinois, in which the State Capitol is SPRINGFIELD.

I guess folks like West and Smiley and even BET founder Jones feel that Obama has to kiss and wipe their ass for permission, or worse, that he aint black enough to stand for or represent black folk in America. Especially given his perspective regarding where Obama’s loot is coming from. Talking about "white” folk and “Jewish” folk money and all.

To me it shows that he is able to gather support from all folk not to mention that the astute scholar, who I met personally while in Ethiopia during an AIDS conference, doesn’t seem to recall that legal and tender notes we call dollars are green and have no religious affiliation. He called him the “skinny guy with the funny name.”

West himself, when invited to Chicago by Rev. Michael Pfleger to speak at his St. Sabina mass said himself that “We have been living for 40 years in a political, moral and spiritual ice age.”

Like I said, its been 40 years since that day an assassin murdered one of my idols, one of the men, regardless of color that spawned my mind to think freely, and critically. And what has happened since then, I would suggest little, now we enslave ourselves. But it took Moses 40 years, maybe now is really the time.

91 comments:

PrettyBlack said...

Okay All-Mi-t your big beautiful ass picture happens to be blocking the words of the first paragraph...can we work on that?

The True Urban Queen said...

I read your blog before you blocked it with your picture. I had to step away and step back. And when I did there was that picture blocking the words. Nice picture. Hope that makes sense.
Anyhoo, you can please some people some of the time and others never. Some support and others hate. Travis is (to me) one of those guys who does for the people but, at the same time, with his own agenda in mind.
You remember (vivdly) 40 years ago? Here I thought you were just about twenty six.

VAR said...

Great post, T.
Yo man, despite all the so-called advances that we're blessed with? I sometimes wish I possessed a time machine that could transport me back...

Tavis will come around in a few months and be all smiles for Obama. He just got his feelings a little bit hurt...

Yasmeen Christian said...

Excellent Post once again, you know I'm a fan over here ;-)

PrettyBlack said...

Well I can't get the gist without reading the whole thing and the pic is still blocking it hon, I'm sorry.

sharon said...

Did I hit a nerve? Where is your memories on that day at? The one you told me to read? Or as you wrote "read it".
I'm 35 so I guess I missed the cutoff (teasing).
Don't bark at me.

coleman said...

you wrote:

"Forty years, so what has happened since then? Let’s us see, well outside of more folk like me on television and in movies, albeit still in the roles of tricksters and clowns, fewer African American farmers, lower literacy rates and easier access to guns, credit cards, and strip malls (and clubs), I would suggest very little."

Let's look at that broad attack you've made.

First, entertainment. Since 1968 the numbers of blacks in the entertainment world has skyrocketed. Soared. Exploded. Is that bad?

TV roles? In 1968? What? Mod Squad and I Spy? Now? Today? More than I can count in a hurry.

Movies? Same story.

All sports? The sport world has expanded and blacks have filled a growing percentage of player ranks everywhere. What is the percentage of white players in the NBA? There's a minority group.

Why mention farmers? The number of independent farmers has been declining for 100 years. White, black, whatever. Agriculture has changed and the change has no connection to race.

You mentioned literacy. How do you know black literacy rates have dropped since 1968? However, if your claim is true, does that mean you believe earlier school practices were better than today's methods? Like segregated schools?

Guns? You mention "easier access to guns."

Clearly you think blacks are irresponsible people who cannot be trusted with guns. As though it is inevitable that a gun in the hands of a black guarantees a crime will occur.

Your comment says you think some force -- the government -- must stop blacks from obtaining guns. That adds up to a serious criticism from you, and it includes a large dose of hopelessness.

Then you move to credit cards. Here too, you have expressed your feeling that a credit card in the hands of a black is a dangerous thing. That misuse is certain. So you want blacks to have less borrowing power.

Then strip malls. Ah. The place to go wild with the credit card. And strip clubs. In other words, you were not about to leave sex out of this critical picture.

In short, you have stated that blacks can't handle all the freedom that exists in this country. It seems you want "society" to set limits.

In your mind, is there any part of black life that HAS improved over the last 40 years?

coleman said...

p.s., you wrote:

"Yes, we have seen four or five Presidential candidacies from the likes of Jackson, Chisom and recently, Obama."

There have been no black presidential candidates till Obama. Jesse Jackson was not a serious candidate and he knew it. His actions were barely symbolic.

Shirley Chisholm was also never a presidential candidate. But she did represent Brooklyn in the House.

What of it? There's been black representatives, senators, governors, mayors, cabinet members, heads of agencies and joint chiefs of staff. If that's not change since 1968, what is?

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

Coleman - whi said serious, u not me, and i think u must be older than me, when i was 10 in 1972 she ran for the precidency...Overall, people in fourteen states voted for Shirley Chisholm for President, in some fashion or other. After six months of campaigning in eleven primaries

The there were others Dr. Alan Keyes,Senator Carol Moseley Braun, Al Sharpton...RIF reading is fundamental..as Marcus Garvey said...A people without the knowledge of their past history, origin and culture is like a tree without roots. Marcus Garvey
come back correct folk ok


Pretyblack - my fault

True Urban Queen - he Hollyhood, is tha what u saying LOL

Var - Nat Turner would have had his head LOL

Yasmeen - a fan do tell more, and about your books too, how long


Coleman - back to u, no, material contamination dosnt count. U tell me wha has improved, is it education, is it schools, is it home ownership, is it economic prowess, so u can by a benz and a flat screen, do tell folk

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

PS leave your URL (so folks can see who u are and read your blog)and email if u like and we can take this to the private aves of cyberville, if not keep posting in public im down

and I never said they cant handle he freedom, my poin is based on numbers, i teach statistics, and 40 years is not any time to show progress in comparison of the 400 years of bondaged that evinced prior, is such a postulate incoherent i your mental sphere?

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

one more point, again, i could have explained it in a purly mathematical sense....you know in terms of Axiomatic set theory..but would have lost some folks,u know, propositions about mathematical objects (numbers, functions, & shit like that....and where in pittsburg are u located?

Jaded said...

Unfortunately, I don't think society in general has advanced. All of us have experienced the dumbing down of schools and their expectations. You see how hard I have to fight just to get my kid what she's entitled to by law. Luckily, I actually KNOW the law, most parents don't in situations like mine. I go in armed with my Master's in Special Ed and 8 years of classroom experience and they still try to pull one over.

During my time teaching, the pervasive thinking was to just pass kids. If they're failing, give them less to do. Give extra credit. Give easier work. Pass them at all costs, whether they've masted the material or not. Hell, whether they've got even a slight understanding of the material or not. Get 'em in, get 'em out. In my particular situation, it didn't have anything to do with race because they wanted all of them in and out in order to save a buck or two. How can any society thrive and grow when education and excellence aren't even spoken in the same sentence?

coleman said...

torrance, a few points.

Lots of people enter the presidential primaries. But only a few are viable candidates. Then there is Ralph Nader. He's run in every election for a number of years. But he knows he isn't going to win. Thus, he's not a real candidate. But his presence on the ballot does affect the outcome.

If Nader had not run in 2000, Gore would have won the election. If Perot had not run in 1992, Bush 41 would have won a second term.

Shirley Chisholm was not the Democratic presidential candidate in 1972. George McGovern was. She might have run in a few primary races, but that's it. As respected as she was, there was no chance she'd get nominated.

As for Carol Braun, no, not a viable candidate. And Al Sharpton? You've got to be kidding. The last thing Al would ever do is run for office. If he wanted to run in New York City, he could win a seat on the city council, or the NY state senate in Albany. He might even have a shot at winning the seat once held by Shirley Chisholm.

But then his finances would get a close look. He's already in trouble for money matters. He's got his hand into the cookie-jar of National Action Network funds and he doesn't need an IRS investigation. But I think it's happening anyway.

Allen Keyes was also never a viable presidential candidate. He's an interesting guy, but not presidential material.

As far as improvements in black life go, well, it's obvious that opportunities are wide open.

Say what you want, but getting a college education is easier than ever. And doors are open to blacks with degress in subjects that matter. Not black history. But serious subjects.

As for home ownership, there is no doubt home ownership among blacks has increased since 1968.

There is no doubt the borrowing power of blacks has soared since 1968. Borrowing power is considered a good thing.

As for the impact and meaning of education, well, that's entirely individual. Black dropout rates are high and black college graduation rates are low, but they are still better today than 1968.

However, black women seem to be finishing college. But blacks are still a long way from catching up to whites and asians in the college graduation department. The message has to get through that prayers are answered through education.

You said material gains don't count. Why not? Goods and services are the basis of an economy. It doesn't matter if someone drives a Saturn or a Benz. Everything is more affordable today compared with 1968. Maybe gasoline is more, in relative terms, at the moment. But cars get much better mileage, so it's still the same bite.

But you don't have to buy stuff. It's not a requirement of living.

What's missing, in your opinion?

You wrote something like... forty years isn't much compared with 400 years of slavery.

It's time to give up that argument. No blacks alive today know anyone who was a slave in the US. No black alive today has any personal experience with slavery.

What possible connection exists between people who were living in the US 145 years ago and people living here today?

The slavery argument boils down to claiming that blacks are forever burdened by something that ended 145 years ago. Since nothing can change the past, is it possible for you to believe improvements lie ahead?

One-third of all Jews in the world were killed by Nazi Germany. No one will ever forget what happened only 65 years ago. But the past does not stand in the way of the future.

And if you want to explain things in Axiomatic set theory and in statistical terms, that's okay with me. I understand that stuff.

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

Jaded - thats why we loosing out around the world. And we cant survive.

Coleman - all i am saying is that this essay is about math, combined with the methorphorical connection with the journey of Moses. $0 yrs aint shit, thats my point, and back in the day, Ms. Chismom running ws big shit, at least in my household, Just as excited then as with Obama, and Hank Arron, and the 1984 Olympic Hocket team.

Samii Styles said...

Get em all-mi-t!

When the tables are turned they will see...

Math ain't my best subject, but I can see that the shit is not adding up...

I feel you dawg!

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

samii - good looking folk, shot me an email, if u assured of your interior design skills..and im tired of taking on folks with brain, no comfort to re-energize it at home u know, but i will, dont no brothers seem to like to engage they mind like the like to floss and ball go figure

coleman said...

torrance, you wrote:

"all i am saying is that this essay is about math, combined with the methorphorical connection with the journey of Moses."

Other than mentioning a few numbers, there wasn't anything in your post about math. As for Moses wandering in the desert, it's just a coincidence that King was murdered 40 years ago and Moses was said to have wandered for the same period.

But we don't live in an uncharted world and there is no pharoah tyrannizing this country.

Meanwhile, Obama is the first viable black presidential candidate. Unless disaster strikes Obama, he's headed for the nomination. His name will be on the ballot in November.

If you want a sign showing the upward curve of black life, his candidacy is one of the clearest.

Aunt Jackie said...

My Father said something that really hit home to me the other day which is that as wonderful as it is to see Obama as a viable Presidential Candidate, it will take a movement for us to see true change. The minds of many must be sparked so that regardless of what happens we have many leaders...

40 years later, has it really taken us this long to have a new leader, and if so who will follow, who will heed the call to be apart of a movement?

Thought provoking men like yourself give me hope...

thanks darlin' I appreciate you a whole lot today!

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

Coleman - i think mathematically, i dont just assert, For example, you looked at it as if I said serious, no 4 or 5 (math) it is simple pure yet complex to others . It is not even about Obama, West or Tavis, but that now they are super critical but hold tsils between their legs when confronted by multi million dollar faces of the establishment who hapen to be white. know the deal, being the one of 4 aa professors in my school of Pub Health a Emory with 500. had to beat folk down wit brain cells cause they talked wo researching or knowing. I battle them, why tavis and Cornell cant battle them and handle ours at home, is all im saying, and the scholar would have detected the math model it wasnt hidden, But many of us cant see the forrest for the trees

Jackie - thank you, but I follow no one, and i hope no one would follow me, maybe listen, but not follow, thats our problem, and the we attack and ridicule without basis, we are porly informed and can be led off a cliff like a russian shrew

Jaded said...

Racism is a condition that has to be taught. If you grow up in a household where your parents throw around the N word, you will have that sentiment deeply engrained. If you grow up in a household where white people are vilified, that will become part of who you are. You will then teach your children the same set of morals and values, whether they're right or wrong.

It takes several generations to break cycles like this. Yes, it's been 40 years since Dr. King died, but that's only the equivalent of what, two generations? How many generations of people grew up believing that African Americans were only 3/5 human? It will take more than 2 generations to remove the hundreds of years of teaching that mind set.

I consider myself pretty well educated, and perhaps a scholar. Math, however is NOT my thing. But it doesn't take a math whiz to understand that 2 generations can't undo the damage of 20+ generations. Sometimes even baby steps are huge.

coleman said...

jaded, you wrote:

"it's been 40 years since Dr. King died, but that's only the equivalent of what, two generations? How many generations of people grew up believing that African Americans were only 3/5 human?

Three-fifths human? That legal status ended with the Civil War. Over 140 years ago. Since you think a generation is 20 years, that means seven generations have passed since the 3/5 rule was erased.

The country was a century past the 3/5 rule when MLK was leading the civil rights movement.

Meanwhile, black immigrants arriving after 1968 account for a huge percentage of the black population. For millions of blacks there is no common history going back to the days of slavery. Just as there is no connection between today's white population and slavery.

In 1860, the population of the United States was 30 million. About 3 million of that 30 million were slaves. Ten percent.

The population today is 300 million, and about 12%-13% are black. Or about 37.5 million. A big percentage were not born in the US. In other words, the US looks great to someone born in almost every country in Africa, Haiti or other Caribbean island.

Xavier Pierre Jr. said...

Thanks for the love. Ali and I appreciate it from the bottom of our heart.

But man, do you see why I HATE coming to your blog. LOL You gonna get me fired from work man! How you gonna dangle some good shit like this in my face and expect me not to bite? But that’s the whole point isn’t it. You, my brother, are on point as always. I will even add to your premise by saying that Abolition and Suffrage were the real movements. Civil Rights (post MLK) and Women’s Lib, were used effectively by the white establishment to destroy the black family. And still, Blacks support the Democratic Party, election after election, like blind lemmings, even as our literacy rates plunge, our teen pregnancy rates rise, our incarceration rates skyrocket, and our collective self-esteem is diminished with successive generations of racial self-loathing. When will our people wake up?

Peace and Love,

Ali’s Zay (http://LoversA.blogspot.com)

PS: Is it just me, or do some people protest too much? ;-)

coleman said...

torrance, you criticized Smiley and West for some remarks they made about Obama.

Why?

Smiley runs a talk show. It's his job to ask questions of people who are recognized for their viewpoints.

West is about as well known as any black scholar in the US. However, I can tell you his opinions don't get much coverage in the Main Stream Media.

But based on your comments, you think Smiley and West should support or praise Obama simply because he's black.

I think both Smiley and West are objective enough to weigh the positives and negatives of Obama. But Smiley is the show-host, which means he doesn't take sides. He gives guys like West a place to speak.

As for Obama beginning his campaign in Springfield, until reading your blog I had not seen a word of criticism about Obama launching from the Illinois capital. If the subject was discussed, it was a waste of time because it is irrelevant.

As for your assertions about math, well, you'll have to explain to me how math is part of your posts.

But clarity means using simple words in ways that are easy to understand.

You commented on something about money and whites, but the meaning was impossible to understand.

Jaded said...

Coleman:

The fact that we are far removed from slavery doesn't negate the fact that for generations after, people were still taught that African Americans were "less than." The fact that legally, slaves were free and considered to be an actual whole human being doesn't mean that society thought that way. 40 years ago, segregation was the norm. So, if you're trying to say that all were considered equal because Lincoln begrudgingly signed it into law 145 years ago, please excuse me while I laugh. As late as then 1960's, many white people saw nothing wrong with having separate schools, water fountains and public restrooms. To say someone isn't good enough to even use the same toilet as a white person isn't exactly a testament to equality, now is it. You can't legislate away prejudice. How interesting that you believe passing a law magically changes the way society thinks.

It is the generally accepted norm that a generation - from the birth of a parent to the birth of a child - is between 20 and 25 years on average. Although, some consider it to be more along the lines of 27 years. On average, the distance is greater between a father and son than a mother and daughter, but that's kind of splitting hairs, as it were. You act as though I pulled that number out of thin air. Check with any geneologist and they'll tell you the same. Although, as a society, we often speak in terms of things like "generation x" or "the Pepsi generation" or consider technology to be generational. By those standards, the turn around for a generation is much smaller. There have been studies done and papers written about this. My assertion comes from actually having read some of those things. And if we go with the longer periods between generations, we aren't even 2 generations removed from segregation, which solidifies my point.

I think it's a very narrow minded, naive and idealistic thought process that says just because something is written on paper, all people automatically adjust their way of thinking. I still assert that the passage of 40 years from the time African Americans were relegated to the back of the bus, refused entry into restaurants, had segregated schools and even segregated public restrooms until present day is not enough time to change the mindset of those who believed that segregation was a good thing. If the mindset had changed completely from the time of slavery, then segregation would have never been discussed, let alone implemented and considered necessary. The whole "all men are created equal" certainly looks good on paper and in theory - but the reality is vastly different.

Blah Blah Blah said...

...I think it's been our time.

There is not going to be one event...or one person that's going to be "the one" event that's going to make us move...
There are catalyst every day that should shove us into action...and we do, for a time. But even then, we rush in without plans and goals...and rarely support from our own people.
Even civil rights activist had a plan... even the black militant (Black Panther party) had training and a goal...
We live in a nation that is about "self"...that says, if I don't see anything wrong with the way things are...then I'm not fighting.
We are so happy with the scraps that are thrown to us that we don't see the ingorance of excepting "scraps"...we need to be sitting AT the table.
It's our God given right to be outspoken, radical in our beliefs, stubborn about or ethics, knowledeable in politicking and loyal to ourselves...yet and still...we've been waiting...
...well, maybe now is the time...
maybe.

KELSO'S NUTS said...

"Coleman," you know I'm one smart Jew and you can't get away from me. It seems, I can't get away from you is the problem.

Torrence is tolerant.

I am not.

I am really enjoying his blog.

So, please cut the crap with the "____, you wrote..." and the veiled racism.

Best to just write how you really feel without the forensic formalities and the subtle racism. There was a famous piece of a Malcolm X speech to that effect, si o no?

We are ALL racists to one degree or other. We are ALL sexists and bigots to one degree or other. Everybody. So, I think it would be better to not adopt such a high-handed attitude and just let it fly as you've come to do on my blog. .

But it's his blog, not mine. I've gotten you to be a respectful contributor to my blog without losing your voice. Or your strong opinions. I do agree with Torrance that you should provide a URL as everyone else does. Please start doing so on mine as well. Thanks.

I'm actually glad you're here so in a cross-cultural context many sides of being JEWISH are on display. I don't want to rehash OUR arguments, though, about Al Sharpton or race in America or anything. The short strokes are for me that Sharpton is a complcated and flawed guy, but bright and talented in many ways. If Torrance or anyone else cares to read them, he or she is free to do so at Kelso's Nuts.

But, gee whiz, I didn't expect to see you here and I got distracted and off purpose. I came to add my perspective to the King/West-Smiley-Obama issue and get some education in the process. I can always take a lesson. Or give one.

Enough with "Coleman". I am a secular cultural Jew of the labor-left by family and he's the other kind. I write this because...

Torrance, you know my background so you won't be surprised to read that for me and my family Dr. King was an essential figure, devastatingly effective when alive, of enormous historical significance now, perhaps for one of the REASONS he was killed in Memphis. He was not there on a single-race issue, but rather on a multi-ethnic labor issue. A transit strike. Having begun his career focused on civil rights nd having added world peace to his mission, Memphis was yet the next step forward for him: tackling questions of economics and class and using that to unite Southern Blacks and Southern Whites (perhaps those of the MOST racist bent) on an issue of common importance. Economic justice.

There are those who say that the material evolution and broadening of King's power (in the good sense) into this area what what made him TOO much of a threat to the status quo. I think that has quite a bit of valence, as the assassination of Malcolm X at exactly the time his own expansion if you will was taking shape suggests.

There has not been a union of civil rights, civil liberties, peace, justice, and labor tribes in the USA with any power (in the instrumental sense) SINCE the assassination of King. I hate that this aspect of his philosophy has been shut off the "celebration" and cordoning-off of his memory into a convenient bite-sized image: religious civil-rights activist who was TOLERABLE for EVERYONE.

It's fucking horseshit. He was not only an advocate of a non-violent civil rights struggle. He was also a tough and learned advocate for everyone. And I think it behoovesa all people to read more than his "I have a dream..." speech and maybe start with "Letters..." That alone will show how much of a leader he was.

OK...I'll stop and continue with Smiley-West-Obama in next comment!

What can I say. I'm windy!

coleman said...

jaded, you wrote:

"I still assert that the passage of 40 years from the time African Americans were relegated to the back of the bus..."

You should check your dates. Rosa Parks and her refusal to move to the back of the bus occurred in 1955. Not 1968.

You wrote:

"...refused entry into restaurants,..."

Civil rights legislation prohibiting discrimination on the basis of race had been enacted before 1968. That happened early in the Johnson administration.

You wrote:

"...had segregated schools..."

Many blacks want a return to separate schools, and, as you must know, there are colleges and then there are black colleges. Do any whites attend Howard? Meanwhile, some black public schools in NY City are separating students by gender.

You wrote:

"...and even segregated public restrooms until present day is not enough time to change the mindset of those who believed that segregation was a good thing."

Segregated public rest rooms today? Where?

Meanwhile, Louis Farrakhan and the Nation of Islam want a separate black nation within the US. A separate black state is a leading goal of the organization. The NOI may be a fringe operation, but it's been around for many decades. Obama has links to it and those links will cost him some support, if not the election.

In any case, your concern with segregation is a return to the past. People congregate where they want to congregate. Affiliations are not prohibited or limited by race. But it seems you want to believe the deck is stacked on racial terms. But it's not.

KELSO'S NUTS said...

T:

I think you need to do at least one King discussion every month because there's too much to write.

I missed the entire Tavis Smiley dust-up. What was that about? When I lived in NYC I'd listen to his show on WNYC and found it pretty good and found him to be a pretty broad-minded guy. You know I'm no fan of Obama's so I'm especially curious about Smiley.

Ah, Cornel West. I think he's a great scholar with one problem. Down deep he's too competitive and insecure. He seems to feel the need to put distance in terms of commercial appeal between himself and Skip Gates and Anthony Appiah because, truth to tell, I think and I think West thinks that they are superior scholars. So, his scholarship has suffered for his "shtick" or "vaina".

[You know Northern South American Spanish, right? If you don't know this word, remember it, "vaina". It's the single great all-purpose word. I guess it's closest equivalent is the meaning of "shit" in English not as body waste or a curse but to mean something all-encompassing].

But to show the OTHER side -- from "Coleman's" -- of the American Jewish "vaina", despite getting annoyed by West's routine, my family was 100% behind him and Gates and Appiah versus Summers in that polemic.

And more to that point and to King and Jesse Jackson, Sr., and "Coleman' and everything else...

One of the more bitter examples of the LACK of King in American life was the "Hymietown" episode. I guess I was 21 or so at the time and I remember vividly discussing it was my Dad on the JFK train going out to Aqueduct racetrack on a Saturday. I remeber neither of us being particularly pissed at him for it. In fact, we both thought it was kind of funny in a ball-busting kind of way. What scalded our nuts, however, was his explanantion: "well, you don't see it the right way; for us the Holocaust goes on every day and you are just another kind of White people to us..." Torrence, you had responded earlier to another story I told about my Dad by saying he had an "open mind." You got that one right. On that subway ride the discussion of Jackson didn't end there. My Dad said to me: "yeah he's a cocksucker, but isn't he right in a way? Getting past that is important but I don't think I'll live to see it."

He's still alive. What do you think? Has he seen it? I never asked him again because I'd forgotten about the conversation until just now.

And -- finally -- Obama. For reasons very much having to do with "the Green Party" as in the money in my pocket, I've found a good political friend in the Congressional Black Caucus. They consistently vote my way on issues of material importance to me. Why hasn't Obama joined it? And does anyone who likes Obama find that weird or troubling given how the campaign was always destined to come out?

Xavier Pierre Jr. said...

@Coleman:

You asked "Do any whites attend Howard?" Are you trying to imply that the answer is anything but YES? In fact my research tells me the student body is only 88% black. Most black colleges are having trouble keeping the ratio above 50%.

Peace and Love,

Ali's Zay (http://LoversA.blogspot.com)

KELSO'S NUTS said...

XP, Jr:

My cousin from Richmond got his DDS at Howard. A long, long time ago!

Curious said...

This is intersting, It's like Bill Buckley and his Firing Line show never died. Wish I could say more, but instead I'll just sit back and watch the fire works.

MyWindow25 said...

I viewed the same thing you watched yet you missed West's point. He added that he will BACK Obama any day whenever he is subject to white supremacy. Because he hates white supremacy.

Tavis and West and many other black leaders are merely saying why wait for a another black leader to bring change when we all as blacks are talented enough and more than qualified to lead our homes and communities to the life we've long for and have envisioned in our minds.

This " Save us" mentality is old! The questions you raised are good but the message and purpose of STATE OF THE UNION is being missed.
It is to have our black communities all over the nation brought to the fore front of awareness!So there won't be any excuses for not taking action in the present day and the future.

You seem inclined so you should know we have a majority of blacks who sit and politic and judge from a distance. Then there are those who change our politics and continue to risk their jobs and lives daily for the benefit of a better world as a whole for all the people.

As an individual I take and throw away what I don't need, especailly when viewing panels such as this one. All our cases and issues with our world are different so everyone 's soultion may not work.

I agree with Tavis and West that people will ignorantly vote based on race and gender. QUALIFICATIONS SHOULD BE THE ONLY FACTOR and that's what Tavis and West are trying to get people to consider in their decision making.

Also, it's funny how black America is ready to get involved with politics after 40 years when we all know there have been blacks that have run or have been considered for Presidency that are more qualified than Hilary and Obama combined.

But to clearly get us all to see how we just suddenly wanted to be involved with politics when a black man announces he's going to run for president. We as a people seemed desperate for change by acting this way when change has been here. Obama isn't our HOPE.

It's everyday people who make a difference. That's why they go to the cities to rally so we can change things. That's all Tavis is saying. Our problems won't vanish regardless who os president we still have to play our part!

I love Obama but your children or your family members are the ones that will change the this world. The Exec. Prsident is only there to provide order. It's us who make the diffence.

Please don't be angry or disappointed with men who watched blacks slide into fear and comfort zones.

Their anger comes for people not realizing the power we have always had. And to suddenly gain hope through this election shows how lazy society has made us.

We never waited to be motivated. We got up and fought our battles at all cost. What if Obama never ran for exec. chair then where were the people going to gain there motivation.

Just like religious people hide behind the church people want to hide behind Obama! I believe he'll need the help of many but people are looking and waiting for him to do it all!! It's up to us all not just OBAMA that was the point!

Peace and Power.
Cecilia~

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

Dang, i dont know what to say, so much to respond too, and all of this while was teaching my stat classes.

I will take them one at a tme when I get home folk

Jaded said...

Ugh, clearly reading comprehension isn't your strong suit. I'd suggest that you read the entire sentence before commenting on part of it. The sentence was as follows:

"I still assert that the passage of 40 years from the time African Americans were relegated to the back of the bus, refused entry into restaurants, had segregated schools and even segregated public restrooms until present day is not enough time to change the mindset of those who believed that segregation was a good thing."

That says FROM that time, during which those things occured, until THIS one, the mindset has changed little. The "from" and "until" signify the passage of time.

The fact that you are unwilling to listen to anyone else's opinions in reference to racism and societal views merely serves to prove my point. You believe what you believe, regardless of evidence to the contrary presented by many people from many walks of life. You are absolutely entitled to your opinion. However, an opinion is based on one's interpretation of the facts at hand. Failure to recognize certain facts thereby renders an opinion invalid.

I'm done commenting with you. It's not my blog, so I won't take up more of Torrance's space. You can just argue amongst yourself.

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

coleman

Again i said "seen for or five Prsidential candacies {i did not say viable or not viable]. Did not say they were the nominated. Is it not true? A running was positive in my book.

Opportunities after the end of Jim crow and since yes, but as i said "little has changed" since KINGS death.

History is a serious subject in my book and yo are correct, but if the anual income is the same, yet tuition rates increase, while the annual income of other ethic groups increases, then "things have not changed" ergo, proportionally speaking rates have unchanged over the last 40 yrs, and infact have declined collectively, i did not pick a gender. Besides I would suspect a person would be more afraid of me than a woman just based on history, how many women can u recant of that were lynched for looking a white men, yawl were never lynched for looking at black women...

Borrowin has increased, with regard to lewd practices such as higher rates for AA compared to whites, but hats anoher story.

No accumulated wealth takes years. So 400 versus 40 is accurate. If we ran around a track to accumulate distance, and i was chained while you ran for 400 yers and then let go, who would have the greatest amount of distance accumulated i know basic math

Materials dont in my purview, for I was taught that the only material was how you use your mind, because that last until death. How long does a car or tv last, so u maybe right on that, since it is based on home training and that is what i was taught and what i belive, for i was taught that what u have or own does not make or define the person, were u taught that too?

Again, like i responded "I may have lost some folks" I did not say all. And my blog is not writen for COLEMAN perse, but for me, sorry bout that folk.

And it was and is metaphorical, coincidence mabey but it is accurate is it not.

And no i is not he is a single individual not the colective. Individual accomplishment to equal group accomplishments


Because my critique was based on my personal view, is that a crime. I felt they could have done it behind closed doors thts all, hat how me and my folk in my social club did it, which the Po Pos caled gang. Pesonal subjective judgment, like picking how you fry fish.

We agree on Springfield, but he was critisized for it by West.

Nope they dont have to praise or suport him, i hate endorsements, they dont mean shit. Im saying be critical of his views, as you and dont support because he is black, but if folks choose to their choice, i know folks who support folks cause they went to school wit them, or from their state, if thats why they do so then so be it, u dont cry foul abou that do u. In Nov, folks will support folks based on party alone, is that foul? i is the same as supporting someone because of their race to me, but i aint mad

nd u welcme here at any time, i just wish you had to courage to reveal your blog or www page. Me, i have nothin to hide folk

jalishouse said...

Tavis Smiley thinks way too much of himself and his importance to "the community".

I want to see coleman's page myself. Now I have to come back for the rest of this debate.

Aunt Jackie said...

Torrance, as an educator I would hope that someone is listening to you, someone is watching you and realizing that their education is valuable...I sincerely hope that you are an example to at least one student.

KELSO'S NUTS said...

T: Tampoco. You devil! YOu didn't tell me you taught stat! Your students will love the Tversky-Kahnemann (sp?) NBA example of the Binomial Distribution and the accompanying bar bet.

Bring a SPORTING NEWS NBA register to class and ask for a consensus of who the streakiest shooter in the NBA is. "Iverson" will probably be the answer. It was "Toney" when I was in school. Turn to the Iverson page and have them see how many shots he takes and what his shooting % is and run it through the Binominal Formula and they'll see if such a thing as a "shooting-streak" in basketball exists!

The bar bet: You tell someone that if he or she writes down an imaginary sequence of "heads" and "tails" from 50 imaginary flips and then takes out a quarter and flips it 50 times actually writing down the results of each flip, that you'll bet him or her that you'll be able to guess the real series of flips and you'll lay him or her 7-to-5 odds.

Do you know how it's done? It's great and so simple. If you don't know I will tell you the answer when you've responded to EVERYONE'S comments.

Curious: You may be right, but if so, I KNOW I'm Galbraith!

coleman said...

xavier,

Typo. When writing ""Do any whites attend Howard?""

"any" was meant to be "many"

You answered the question and made my point. There is no criticism of black colleges -- schools that aim to attract a student body based on race. As I said, people can choose to congregate as they like.

coleman said...

torrance, it's your view that:

"Opportunities after the end of Jim crow and since yes, but as i said "little has changed" since KINGS death."

What do you mean by "change"?

Since King's death every major US city has had a black mayor. There have been black police chiefs. Black education chancellors. Black governors, senators, representatives, and much more.

No black presidents or vice presidents. But when you consider we've had only 43 presidents in 220 years, you know they form a small club. But we are closer now than ever to electing the first black president. Even if Obama loses the election, he's opened the door for the next black candidate. That is change. Big change.

You went back to the past, though, with this:

"...how many women can u recant of that were lynched for looking a white men?..."

None. But why does it matter? What's gained by steering discussions of today into recalls of the past?

The extreme estimate for lynchings puts the death toll at less than 5,000. Some say 3,500. Ninety percent occurred before 1920. That means there are almost no whites alive with a connection to these murders. This segment of racial history is part of the past. It can't be undone. But it won't be repeated.

You shared your views on building wealth with this:

"No accumulated wealth takes years. So 400 versus 40 is accurate."

Almost every black athlete was born in poverty. But every big-time black athlete is a multi-millionaire. In other words, one generation from poverty to wealth. One.

The same is true for most of the big names in black entertainment. Especially music.

Then there's Oprah. Of course she's only one person. But there is an endless string of black athletes and entertainers who will become millionaires in their 20s. That was not true before 1968. The door is wide open. It is open because we live in a meritocracy, which means it's okay to beat the competition.

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

athelets and musicians and artist and movie stars aint the average, are they. Anywho. I hav said what i menat, meant what I wrote. Let it be written - let it be down, time t cook dinner folk. So in short, i wasn't trying to change your mind or argue, just express my thoughts, they are my thought so accept them or dont LOL. u act lke this contest or something - did i touch a nerve

KELSO'S NUTS said...

T:

You touched a nerve with him and I don't know why. It's feminists and liberals and left-wing foreign governments when he's on my blog but if you house-break him, you'll find he's an educated guy and has something to add to the conversation. I cut him off on the "post-racial narrative" thing. It's not for me to say for any number of reasons not the least of which is that I don't live in the United States anymore and am not planning to vote because I am protesting the unfair assignment of electors: my vote as an ex-pat counts about 8% as much as a resident of Wyoming does and ex-pats out-number Dicks by about 7-1 I think. I prefer Clinton of the two but I want to see what McKinney's plans are. She might get the Greens past a threshold.

Prob & Stats,Torrance. That's what it's all about.

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

Jackie - y thank u hon and my studenst actually learn.

Kelso, i do, and pimps and hoes to explain regression lol

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

Kelso - u know he didnt bother me. Im confident. I never mention viable and its just my opinion, sounds like h got something to prove, i started not to deal or respond, but u Jaded, and xavier had my bck while i ws teaching....Thanks alot.

I think it started with the black folk who ran for president stuff. I disproved that huh,

i.can't.complain. said...

geesh.

i'ma mess around and learn something foolin' with u.

your granny was a wise lady.

its nice 2 see that her influence is ever present in u.

here's to hoping that our people, like moses, are finishing up our 40 years of wandering.

-1-

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

comeback - is that bad, learning something from me, i can teach if u like, do come back

KELSO'S NUTS said...

T: I assume the Y was the pimp's income and the Xs were the various factors related to the hos, si o no?

I've seen a live, cash-money, prostitution options market at a bar in Moscow. A standard contract was the right to one date usually for $400 with 6AM expiry. It acted pretty much like any options market with assumption of log-normal distribution of prevailing market price of date at opening (around 9PM) adjusted for day of the week, time of the year, and espcially time of night. USD interest rate was deterministic, so price of underlying asset depended on time to expiry,alpha,and "brownian motion." Price of option dependent on volatility.

There was a way to beat it, though. It depended on what free food they put out on the steam tables or if they put any out at all. That could affect the volatility severely. If they put out elk steaks and au gratin potatoes, you were buying puts and writing calls for your lungs. If they put out smoked fish with black bread and not too much butter, you were long for your lungs. And longer still if they put nothing out.

But as for the contretemps on your blog...Fairlane me avisaba doe veces o sea que hay un lechugo de payaso cuya vaina se soporta o tal vez se tolera en el Raw Dawg Buffalo porque el senor Torrence es muy genial y nunca se fastidia ni de nada racista. Pero a la vez me avisaba que yo mismo me cabreare cierto pue' de leer sus polemicas tontas de las razas y tal. Tenia razon el senor Fairlane.

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

Kelso - not in my example. Memphis has 60 pimps and 750 hoes, st louse 30 pimps, 325 hoes, K1..K2...K3....KK...if chigago had 1113 hoes how many pimps do they have lol prediction u know ye old slope intercept, y = mx + B lol

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

PS, kelso - yep u are notes if u think im brilliant LOL. and wha ya mean, dump stuf, i mean polemics regarding the races, so i am warned....we good, but how was he right? do explain in engkish, arabic, Igbo, wolof or german, my spanish aint that good folk

KELSO'S NUTS said...

T: I do think that you're brilliant but "genial" means "pleasant". "Dump stuff" was nowhere. I wrote that Fairlane had warned me about a clown whose routine you tolerated because you were a pleasant guy, and didn't get irritable about racial stuff, but that it would piss ME off to read that foolishness over here because Fairlane expected me to enjoy RDB otherwise. Fairlane was absolutely right. You were tolerant and I was irritated with him.

I can do a simple linear regression problem while waxing my carrot but as this is an educational space, you should throw it open to the public. Linear regression is a very useful tool for everyone to have. And besides, Excel will do it for you! I was taught that it was good to do a few of these by hand though to understand them at a gut level because the technology is sophisticated.

My winter (your summer) plan is to study Arabic and Hebrew. Both, oddly, are very useful in Panama. And I only have about 3 words of each. If I were obsessive/compulsive I'd learn Mandarin and Hindi, too. You've been here, right? Makes New York look like Pensacola.

Christina said...

40 years.. some has changed but this world has a lot of work to do before I put my shoulders down just yet.
I appreciate your thoughts.

PS: You know this officially makes you my older brother right? :+)

DeadMule said...

Martyred At the Lorraine

I can see Martin.
On that balcony.

Hosea. Jesse. Martin. Ralph.

But you will say,
my mind is playing tricks.

That was the night before,
right? Before
he gave that speech
to those garbage men,

going to Mason’s Chapel in pouring rain,
tired as he was.

Sure he would march.
But who would guess,
his final speech

would come in Memphis?

The baritone softly hums “Precious Lord,”
and he smiles.

Wrong again.
That was the day

it happened.

I can see Martin.
At that Negro motel.

He throws out his chest,
waves his hand as he speaks,

guffaws
into the nip of an April twilight,
perhaps picturing his “four little children”:

a robust man, he tells
of what he sees atop the mountain—

in the land beyond,

in the view.

“Oh! . . . ”

The bullet pierced its intended,
and Ralph gently cradled
Martin’s dying head. Who, now,
will choose redemption,

suffering—to implement the dream?

I see Martin carried.
From the Lorraine.

A widening pool of still-warm blood
turns brown.

Helen Losse, “Making All Things New: The Redemptive Value of Unmerited Suffering in the Life and Works of Martin Luther King Jr.,” MALS thesis (Wake Forest University, 2000).
Windows Toward the World http://helenl.wordpress.com/

Lovebabz said...

El Loco de Sr. Kelso,

Usted tiene razón en muchísimos niveles. Lo que falla del diálogo es la noción de tiempo y lo que ha resultado en un período corto del tiempo.

América en la relación al resto del mundo es una nación joven ... un bebé. Hasta ahora hemos pasado por 1 guerra civil. Sospecho que veremos otra vez aquellos tiempo ... no en mi vida, pero otra vez. La raza es un concepto ilusorio cuando la mayoría del mundo no es Blanca. Pero aquí en América parece tomar la etapa de centro.

I do think Dr. Stephens/ Torrence does an amazing job of bringing this conversation to the "everyman" in a way that allows for anybody to jump in and share in this rich dialogue. Regardless of where you stand on the issues of civli rights. aficans in america, moral imperatives, you gotta love that we are able to have this discussion-- post Jim Crow, post march on Washington.

Do forgive my spanish..it has been a long time.

BadTux said...

I taught in black schools for several years. I saw some things there where black men (and women) were pulling each other back. One black man, a preacher man, said to the 8th grade departmental meeting when they weren't going to let a contract to a black lady for some decorations for a class assembly that "this is just that old slave mentality, not wanting one of our sisters to get ahead." Because if one black man (or woman) gets ahead and performs better, then folks expect the rest to do the same. Which was a problem back in slavery days, but nowdays when supposedly we're all free (and more on that another day) and working for our own best interests rather than for massa's, that kinda mentality is a problem. That, and kids (mostly black boys) refusing to perform in school because they're afraid of accusations of "acting white".

Now, I'm not the person to say how to fix what I saw. Just tellin' you what I saw. Now, I seen other things too, like white crackers grumbling about "uppity niggers taking our jobs" and crap like that, but that's something I can do something about (and have). But the problem of black people pulling each other back... well. That's something black folks gotta fix for themselves.

dejanae said...

great post man

M.Kam said...

we ARE keeping ourselves back, the way we rip each other down, refer to each other in less than respectful ways, and the list goes on and on....and i def thought west was behind obama? *sigh* guess not...

KELSO'S NUTS said...

Lovebabz:

Nada de estas tonterias, pue'. Tu facilidad con el idioma es super-chevere super-vacano y super-d.p.m.! Te saludo.

Y tu tambien tienes razon. La nocion de raza es una enfermedad que envena el cuerpo de mi pais anterior. Aqui en Panama, una republican pa' solamente 18 anos y una republica LIBRE del EEUU pa' 9 anos nunca hablamos de estas cosas ni mucho menos por la mezclada.

[Y no importa si prefieras a senor Barack, senora Hillary, ni el hijoputa del senor McCain...Era Bill Clinton que merece todo el honor de nuestra liberacion solo por su reconocimiento del Carter-Torrijos hace 19 anos y su orden de salir a los militares gringos y la CIA. Nada mas, nada menos.]

Los obsesivos de mierda de las nocioes de "raza" en el EEUU no entienden come pueda ser. Aunque no es insulto ni muchisimo menos de DESCRIBIR a cualquier pelado o pelada como "mono," "blanco," "trigueno," "negro" o tal vez "judio" o "arabe" o "chino" o "muslaman" o sea...es solo pa' IDENTIFICAR a dos o mas que a lo mejor tengan los mismos nombres! Nadie da cuenta del color de la piel porque no significa nada normativa. Hay de todo. "Blancos" pobres. "Negros" ricos. De todo. Judios y arabes se casan de vez en cuando! Es una vaina distinta a la gringa.

Y todo lo que dicen los democratas del EEUU de los otros paises se reien de ustedes es la verdad. Clinton nos regalo crecimiento economico de mas que 8% anual y fuera del NAFTA ademas. 3 anos desde la llegada de Bush, el EEUU se puso aco una broma, un ejemplo del estupidez en cualquier vaine especialmente en los negocios (jajaja!)

Para mi las problemas de alla no tienen mucho que ver de cuantos anos se cumplio la union. Ni de las razas ni las etnicidades ni la vaina de quien sea "gay" o heterosexual. Ustedes tiene la misma mezcla por alla que tenemos aqui.

Y ustedes TENGAN que figurar una manera de arreglarse con todo esto. Si no...cierto que el pais estara tan roto como su dolar.

Mucho gusto de conocerte. Buena suerte.

Regina said...

Awesome post! It is a shame that there doesn't seem to be too much "Positive" change since the death of MLK, who was a truly awesome man. There has been plenty of change but like I said not much positive about it. Maybe now is the time, we have to wait and see.
All I can say about some other "black leaders" is that if they wanted to run for President they could have, don't hate because you didn't do it.
To not try is to fail.
BTW, are you sure you remember that day clearly?? I had no idea you were that age...
Peace & Love!

Lovebabz said...

Kelso's Nuts

Gracias amablemente. Y estoy de acuerdo con mucho de lo que usted fija. Voy a tener que saltar a su blog y comprobarle.

¡Torrence blog seguro tiene lejos de juntar una mezcla interesante de la gente!

¡Dónde más podría nosotros haberse encontrado además de aquí!

Tamra said...

Torrance--awesome, awesome post. And *WOW* on the dialog. I'm thinking a bit before responding myself... I understand a number of the points being made here, I agree and disagree with bits and pieces of many of them--just am not quite sure how best to condense what I want to say.

Wow! Great dialog!!!

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

tamra - thanks hon. but thats the way of the worlds, money and words. I wish when folk come on here challengeing stuff that some of the bruhs would say something with fact to back me up when im not here like Xavier did. But outside of DC and curious, no one stands up, except for a few of the ladies like jaded, aunt jackie, profesor, bear maiden and fairlane. Outside of tha i can depend on Kelso, christopher, dusty and badtux to represent, and i know black men read me. so do comment to the comments u read, thats why aint nothing changing

Regina - Thank u hon. yea folk, i turned 45 in dec. Read THANK WE FREE I was six, some events you dont forget. and dont worry lil momma, my students, undrgrads sa the same thing, lie i aint that old, or like i look 30, or 35.

Babz & Kelso, yawl having fun LOL

M.Ka - ant that the truth


dejanae - thank u sweety

Badtux - i feel ya, i had some youg men tel me tha i was too cool to be a scientist, and after two weeks, they were like they wanted to be scientist. And the women thing, some men are insecure. At least you know we got to solve that, but aint gone lie, folks lke u got show not just AAs . bu al folk, ntellect is cool, history is cool, and regular folks is cool. My sone like makin god grades cause i tell him women love a smart man LOL

Deadmule - no that was tight, or as me and mine say, thats the shit

Christina - Im honored lil sis

MsPuddin said...

I’m late, but great post.

I have this deep fear, no matter how “unblack” people say Obama is, that if he wins the election, he will be assassinated. If something happens to him, I’m afraid to even predict what might happen.

It is a shame when I look around at this country so many people fought to have a better future, but the future looks grim. Over the last 40 years people went from being fighters, to self-fulfilling their prophecies. When will we wake up?

braincell said...

mspuddin - we men need to take the lead with our brain, and women have to again select men with brains, i feel like im at war by mylonesome

dc_speaks said...

whew...man! I read a good amount of those comments and my head started hurting. Thanks for the shout out. It's always good to see someone express themselves eloquently and allow for rebuttal for blog land.

The post was kick ass! First and foremost let me acknowledge you as the host and the author of the a comment and thought provoking post.

As you and anyone else on your blog that reads mine knows, I also have seen little in the growth of us as a people. I acknowledge the steps in limited industries. ie: sports, entertainment and liberal arts. there are more, but I refuse to write a comment longer than the post itself.

To imagine having lived through a society that fought so valiantly to be heard and less than a generation later, witness opportunities and rights are squandered. It is heartbreaking to those that tell me of their pasts. HBC&U's have made great strides to make a difference and we are inching along.

I certainly can't say that we have come very far. We are still slaves to the same industries that often exploit the talents that we possess as a people.

When the day comes that a child that speaks in grammatically correct sentences living in an urban neighborhood, can freely express himself or herself without ridicule, we can say that we have moved a little bit closer to the next chalk mark on the wall.

Regarding the gentlemen named in the original post, everyone has their own agenda and be it for the advancement of self or people, it is an endless amount of choices to be made. I choose to be educated about the goings on that impact my life through researching facts and question everything that comes through the news and media outlets.

I encourage everyone to do the same.

Thanks for inviting me to your blog party, T. You sure do leave the light on. I'll come around more often. Give you some support and have facts to go along with my statements.

Peace and love to you all!

dc_speaks said...

by the way, you are not alone. cultivating men to be leaders is an art form. It requires that we all break children(boys and girls) from their self entitled way of thinking.

Tamra said...

Hey Torrance,

I responded over on my blog because my post ended up being really long.

Tamra

Verbal Vixen (T Caldwell) said...

We have made some progress in some ways, but in other ways we have taken a step backwards. To make it worse, our current regression is moreso due to what we have done and continue to do to ourselves.

Great post, great blog. I am glad I came by.

Anonymous said...

mspuddin worries that if elected Obama would die by assassination.

Not too likely.

Where's the hate? News coverage of candidates these days misses nothing. Has any hate message been sent by any of the usual suspects? Have un-usual suspects shown hate for a black presidential candidate?

If the answer is yes, then websites devoted to these messages would appear. If there were a website that pushed a no-black-for-president message, another website would appear to fight it.

The topic would attract plenty of main-stream-media attention if there were evidence of real anger. However, every comment I've seen has come from people who discuss the assassination idea as a "worry".

However, if people are worried about assassination, then history should be a guide. The last politician assassinated in the US was Robert Kennedy -- in 1968. But it happened during the primaries, when it was easy for dangerous people to get close to him.

That assassination changed the course of the US. It's a certainty Kennedy would have been nominated, and it's reasonable to think he would have beaten Nixon in 1968. But a .22 caliber bullet to Kennedy's head during the primaries changed everything.

George Wallace was shot and wounded. Reagan was shot and wounded. And Gerald Ford was almost shot. But Squeaky Fromm's gun misfired. Wallace was recognized for his opposition to civil rights, but he was shot by Arthur Bremer, a white male of doubtful sanity. John Hinckley, Reagan's shooter. is also a mental case, as were Ford's would-be assassins.

They all planned to shoot their targets at close range with handguns. That's easy to prevent.

Many Bush critics show a lot of hate for him. A movie was made that included a scene depicting his assassination. Has anyone actually tried? Maybe a Secret Service agent will write a book about his years with Bush and we'll get an answer. But he is alive. If nothing else, he's well protected. As Obama would be.

The dangerous time is now -- before the election, when it's much easier to carry out an attack.

What does this "worry" lead to?

Does it mean voters in the two big primaries of Texas and Ohio will vote for Hillary because they want to save Obama?

I would reject the idea that he is in danger and vote for him.

But based on comments appearing on many blogs and in the media, people are discussing this fear. If ever there was a fear to ignore, this is it.

The idea of using fear of an attack on Obama as a reason to vote for Hillary and save his life is one of the cleverest yet. Fiendishly clever, and not beneath desperate supporters of his opponent.

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

Anon - that is kinda of funny, dont killl Obama, vote for Hillary, LOL i can see it now

Verbal vixon - hank u and do return, and keep writin that poetry me likes

Tamra - i read and commentd, great point, now u gotta add me woman lol

DC - im praying hat u right

karrie b. said...

40 years?!?!? damn.

-karrie b.

Tamra said...

Torrance, I gave in. He came to my blog and I had to respond...

THANKS A LOT! Grrrr. Just kidding. Tho' I said I wouldn't engage, I didn't mind.

PrettyBlack said...

DAMN! That's some pretty cheap shots on their part. Now don't get me wrong I love Cornel and Tavis but them negroes need to quit!

They gone be aight! Judge the man on his politics if your going to judge him. But on something that petty, damn.

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

Karrie - yep, not long at all

Tamra - im sorry my fault 4give me pls

Prettyblack - thats all i a sayin in short

Divine Perception said...

Do you really think after 40 yrs. black folks will get it together? I sure hope so. Too often when a black person begins to do well another will try and tear them down. Eventually, I hope we can begin to lift each other up so that we can move forward and become better as a people.

Torrance Stephens bka All-Mi-T said...

Divine Perception - first thank for the drive by and do return, and no. If you read th comments in this post my point is that am hoping it matches th prable of Moses in the wilderness, but that it will take a long time to overcome 400 plus years

ingridspeak said...

Nothing left to be said. THIS WAS AN EXCELLENT POST!

Kala Nation said...

Raw Dawg excellent post.
To Coleman:You said West and Smiley were being hard on Obama because that is their job to ask tough questions.What planet are you living on?Recently Cornell West along with that fraud Mike E Dyson were in the Source hip hop magazine pandering and defending these filthy rappers and all their garbage.Even the writer questioned their motivation for this.Their motivation is self promotion and popularity.Tavis I watch his interviews with some of the most controversial people and he never ask them an uncomfortable question.I remember when he was on BET he had porn star Heather Hunter on the first time a Black talk show host did such a thing.He did not chastise her or condemn her.So why is he and others like that traitor Robert Johnson of BET so hard on Obama when they did nothing to uplift Black people when they had the chance?This shows after 40 years we have not pulled together but are a bunch of crabs in a barrel.

Blackness said...

Strength to your vision... power to your commentary...

braincell said...

Blackness - good look folk, i see and read wht u write, thank amen-ra for warrior scholars

Kala - thats our problem we either showing out for someone or pandering. well said

Ingrid - u always have something to say, this is your home too

Tigress said...

Hi. :-) I did a post on it being 40 years too. The way I see it, it's only been 40 years and I think people need to put that in the scheme of things. I was eleven when King was killed. I stood on the street and waved at Bobby Kennedy only to hear on the news later that he was killed too.

We have come a long way but we have a long way to go. I remember when I was kid the only time you saw Blacks on t.v. was maybe on a commercial on Sunday and it was a huge thing if you saw a Black face in a movie. I remember when Julia was a huge thing because a black actress finally had her own show.

We're everywhere now. Yes, we should be out there even more but in 40 years we have come a long way.

I'm hoping that each generation will have it better and better. I think each new generation will face less and less until all of this is really just history.

I wish some Black folks with a chip on their shoulder against whites would remember we wouldn't be where we are if it wasn't for them being on our side and helping us because our vote alone would never have gotten us jack.

We've still got a way to go but its only been 40 years. The wounds still have scabs but they're healing.

Kala Nation said...

Ms Tigress the thinking you have is of a slave ignorant mentality.Just so you;d know since you wont probably do research,we had our own movies,businesses ect long before the so called civil rights movement.We are talking about racism and White privilege.We are talking about having resources to solve our own problems and moving ahead.You are still stuck being grateful for the crumbs handed to us by some racist.

Katrina said...

Awesome blog man! You keep us thinking...that's for damn sure!!!

Power to you my luv!

~ Katrina

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