Saturday, July 12, 2008

The scorn of Lady Macbeth

remember muzk u hear is jones here mane, all live impromptu funktry muzk

Addendum: They done raised the price of the AJC to 75 cents. Bought one for 50 cents tuesday from the machine-dang.

It has been said that love is a many splendid thing. This can be no truer than with respect to the love a parent has for their child. But sometimes we can be so selfish that we place our desires and even misery over ourselves to the point where we could care less about the wants, needs, and desires of our children. Which means selfishness and hate can be more powerful and of value for some than love.

I heard a popular female radio commentator say on the air, that she used to tell her child that her father did not want to see them and that he did not love them. In the same sentence she said that told the child that because it made her feel better and gave her the fortitude to justify her keeping the child from seeing and bonding with her father. And the reason, because she did not like him and that their relationship did not work out. It was during the weekend of Father’s day when I heard this. At the end; she said she regretted it for as her child got older and learned, she despised her and that, she sawthe hurt she had caused "her baby."

It made me think. I mean not to use myself, but I have been told by a woman that she would take our child, and the reason she gave was that it would hurt both of us. She smiled when she said this. I ignored it saying no woman would use a child as a pawn and desire to hurt their child, using a child’s love with their father as a weapon. I must add at that time, I did fill out legitimization papers, for if such a day came I would be ready; so if I had to fill for custody, I would be prepared and it would be joint custody, for no matter how I feel about the other, her love and parental rights toward our child would be just as important and equally respected and valued in my eyes.

I often wondered how any person; any parent would deny a child the love of the other parent. It is some of the dumbest and most selfish shit I have ever heard. Up there with weapons of mass destruction and reminds of William Shakespeare’s play Macbeth.

All Lady Macbeth cared about was herself and the idea of being Queen, but at the same time, she despised her husband for his kindness as king. In her heart, he was not evil enough, as she was to be King. She even called him a coward for being just and kind and loving and stated that she had no pity and would even kill her own baby as it suckled at her breast, if she needed to please herself.

So is it true? Is there any justification for a woman to use a child to get back at a person for a failed relationship? Especially if the requirements of love and provision are provided for the child? I would suspect in some case the said woman may even be provided for by the father, but still may lack consideration for the child desire and love of that parent.

I would suggest that a person that does not has no love or concern for their child, especially if the child is not being abused or neglected. That if they did, they would desire for their child’s happiness to come first, in particular if the child had a strong bond with the father. But I also feel that women who grow up in homes with the father present would not do such, for they would have learned the value and love that a father or any parent would give under optimal circumstance. I also feel that women that do not have such in the home do not see the importance of a man in the lives of children and may even be the type to say they don’t need a man. I think that such is what is wrong with our communities and leads young women to think their value is only in their looks and sex, or worse, that they can only make a living by turning tricks or stripping in front of some rapper.

Yep, we men do neglect our fatherly responsibility at times and that’s something I have written about a lot. But not all of us. So ladies you tell me, why is it that some folks cannot live with the reality that a relationship is over, or why is it that the selfishness of an individual can over ride the love a child may have for each parent. Is scorn that much of value that, one would scar a child just to hurt another and make themselves feel good?


Lovebabz said...

There are women who have grown up without their fathers and DO NOT carry on like this. I am one of them. I do not, nor have I ever used my children against their Father. I respect and value the parental bonds of both of us as their parents. This post is lost on me on so many levels.

I am sure a parent that does this sort of vile mess perhaps does love their child(ren) on some level...I however, am not convinced. What I know of love certainly does not include this type of evil manipulation. If my soon-to-be ex husband carried on this way, I would absolutely seek sole custody. My role as a parent does not mean that I protect the fucked up parent, but my children first. Seeking and gaining sole custody doesn't mean that the fucked-up parent stops being the parent, it means there are parameters in which visitation, care and custody are set. Children need to be protected against parents who's motivations aren't about parenting, but pain, havoc and destruction. Call it what you want...this ain't love.

I have seen too many stories of parents harming children and everyone around knows that parent has problems, yet nobody wanted to invite more problems, or upset that person further causing them to possibly do harm to their children, but then when nothing is done, what happens...children are harmed because folks want to operate from a place of emotional bondage rather than handling the matter in a legal and safe way.

Mental instability has a great many triggers. It is like having a bomb in your living room and you have no idea when it will go if and since it hasn't gone off, you believe, well it hasn't happen yet so therefore we keep living with it. HELLO there is a bomb in your living about dealing with it before it explodes?!

memphiz said...

i have a family member who wont let her kids see their dad or grandma. There are some things that justify it... the simple fact that he has called himself the devil i think is pretty good reason.

NoRegrets said...

I have no experience in this, but in my unqualified opinion, I believe it has to do more with the emotional and mental maturity of the individuals. Sometimes it ends up being the right thing. Sometimes the wrong thing.

Traycee said...

I think it is sad and horrible when I see women do this....Yet lets not forget men do the same see men in relationships and or marriage break up and start a whole new family and for get about the kids they already had....

One of my sons is not by my husband...And my sons father (which I have no clue where he is) Was very hurt and upset when I met fell in love and married my husband....He told me he would pay child support ( which he does) but will not see our son ...So I could see how it feels to hurt someone that cares about you....I don't get it ....I'm just glad my son was still a baby and doesn't really have any memories of him...All he knows is my Husband as daddy....He would have succeeded at hurting me if he had hurt my son....

Kai said...

First and foremost I think that there are always 2 sides to a story! The man may say or insinuate that the ex is NOT over the failed relationship.The woman in return may say that the man is actually the one who has not gotten over the failed relationship! When relationships ,esp ones that are tumultuous end , there just may be a feeling of resentment on "both" sides. Children often become caught in the middle of their parents bullsh*t and drama, (hence the pawn game)whether that is the intention of either parent or not! To minimize or altogether eliminate this problem neutral mediation may be required from a third party that has no malicious or hidden agenda.
At the end of the day the best interest of the child should always be placed above and beyond that of the parent! I dont believe that every woman raised without a father or father figure in the household fails to recognize the signifigance of a father in their own childs life! Furthermore a man does not have to reside within the household to play an active role in his child(ren) life ,if he really has an honest desire to do so! Same goes for a woman. I knew my father but when my parents seperated as a child my mother was the sole guardian of my younger brothers and I. She never denied my dad the opportunity to visit or have us visit and spend time with him.She always made sure that we knew and remained in contact with his side of the family ,inspite of their failed relationship. She made certain that we sent cards ,pictures,etc to him and his family. As a child I had occassional hopeful thoughts of my parents reuniting in a relationship,as any children who are young and impressionable do. However with time and maturity I realized that while I loved my mom and dad ,they were better off apart than together! My relationship with either did not have to be compromised just because he did not reside with us! We knew where and how to find him if we needed or wanted to see him!My mom has remarried and I still have relationship with my father,though he resides in another state. In conclusion I say parents who really love their children will cast aside their own selfishness and desires to see through clear and healthy eyes what is in best interest of their child period! If they can not do this its time to go to court, and allow a judge to determine what is in the best interest of that child!

IntrospectiveGoddess said...

I agree with lovebabz the feelings or well being of one parent should not go before the best interest of the child...and it is not so black and white as "well the woman never had a father in her life" I think it has more to do with mental and emotional maturity as someone else said and it is selfish to use a child as a pawn no one benefits and everyone loses....I dont have children but I was caught between my mother and father and their tumultous relationship and I know the emotional scarring that can be caused when one is put in the middle of two parents pettiness, scorn and immaturity.

Mizrepresent said...

Well, i know for sure i am not of this way of thinking...i have invited, and pressured my ex to be involved in our children's took a near tragedy for him to finally get the picture. I am hoping that he stays past the emergency, because i believe our children are worth it. I love them so much, i would do all i can to give them what they need, but they also need a father, an only he can give them that.

Missy said...

I believe the source of the problem of women using children as pawns in relationships stems from them trying to gain control over a situation that has long since come undone. Saying that having a father in the home as the primary solution is far too simplistic a solution to be realistic.

Children need TWO positive role models in the home. Just being there doesn't cut it.

You don't really find too many sources talking about this issue. Mostly you hear about deadbeat dads not taking care of their responsibilities.

It takes two to make them, it takes two to rear them.

If you stop and consider that the next person you sleep with could be the parent of your child, perhaps better choices could be made all around.

Roxy said...

I wouldn't know what it's like to be a parent, but as a child I know that a parent's love is unconditional. It's unfortunate that some parents relationships don't work out, but a child, as you said, should NEVER EVER be used as a pawn.

Aunt Jackie said...

you almost had me until you started talking about women tricking and stripping. I'm not quite sure what that has to do with parenting.

I do however strongly believe that from what I've seen children had outside of marriage are often apart of larger problems when those relationships dissolve, as those relationships are recognized legally and lack formality in general.

I've seen that one play out too many times, as I've seen Ex's both men and women try to talk shit about one another to prove that they are the better parent, when in fact only two people busted a nut over that and your partner, it took to make 'em and should take two to make 'em.

I've seen some ugly behavior come out in response to children and custody, which is probably why I don't have any...

Men fail to realize that violence, vile behaviour, verbal abuse and such don't give women much reason to want to leave their children with their ex's.

MacDaddy said...

Raw Dawg: Good stuff. The daddy got you linked!

Anonymous said...

I am a parent and IMO the only reason to keep a child's other parent away from a child is if the other parent is toxic in some way. Emotionally, mentally or physically abusive, otherwise you have to get over yourself.

I have been dealing with my ex-spousal unit for 15 years since we split, the man drives me crazy and let me tell you I am looking forward to 18 mos from now when my son turns 18 and the ex will be out of my hair forever.

That said as much as the man drives me ctazy, I know I have done right by my son by allowing his access to his Pops.

Jackie Edwards said...

I believe there are some circumstances under which it's necessary to keep one or the other parent out of a child's life, when there is abuse emotionally or physically, or drugs or, mistreatment of some nature. Aside from that, I think individuals should be mature enough to put aside their personal differences to do what is in the best interest of their child, that being, having both parents involved in their life. I acknowledge however that sometimes, these things are easier said than done....

Torrance Stephens - All-Mi-T said...

Very well said and I can see your point. About the father thing, but when I heard this a few months ago I thought she was acting, till she said I love my baby and started crying it was sad

That is a very good reason – evil and seth, I mean the devil

I agree with the mental maturity

Wow, he was foul for that and not very manly or fatherly. My ex wife and I have a great relationship, her kids and hubby. No problems albeit she has not seen her son since march and lives in the same city – go figure

True there are two sides, but not rteally, just side of the kid. Like u say they come first, unconditionally
Point well taken as well as exceptionally stated

Scorn is a mf

U a woman, but he was foul for that jones

As many positive and caring and loving role models as possible. Great point.

first thanks for the drive by (u know a lot about make up I tell ya). And u are right, but get some kids they the BOMB

Aunt Jackie
Well that’s petty to me, as long as it aint to the child. I have had a lot of stuff said to me but I aint say nothing back. Was even spit on, and although I wanted to break her neck, I recanted jesus and mlk jr. were spit upon, dog sicked on them, water hoses and thorns on they head and I aint half the men they were so no biggy

Good look folk, im updating roll Sunday im adding every real bruh I can find so I can keep in touch

All I can say Im waiting for u, u sound like a human being to me, and a woman

Jackie Edwards
How ya been folk, first keep your head up queen. And I agree, completely

sista gp said...

I have more questions than any answers. Being a mother I do not understand how a woman could poison a child's view of her father. It was not the fault of the father that the marriage did not survive, so there should not be any animosity towards him.
The mother treated the father as a no-fee ATM. The daughter grew to treat him the same feeding on his guilt of not being in his daughter's life as he would have liked.
The daughter was lied to and manipulated into believing that life with her father would be horrible and she would be better off with the mother.

On the mothers part, is this selfishness, evil, or something else?
For the daughter, is she to be blamed for exhibiting the same characteristics of manipulation as her mother when she is an adult?

Keli said...

It is never justified, and I do not understand (and I do not have any children) how a woman could ever put herself and her feelings above her childs...I have a recently divorced friend that said her husband walked out on her and their son...I had to let her know, you cheated and he left you...he even gave her a chance after a year, but had to leave...because he knew that staying would only cause more confusion for his son. It takes a strong man/woman to be able to put their children first above self...there is nothing I despise more than a woman that uses her child as a pawn. Makes me wanna choke a bitch...especially when you have a man that is willing, ready, and wanting to be a father.

Anonymous said...

Of course you can add me to your roll. I subscribe to you thru Google Reader.

On to the topic at hand. I'll try and keep this short and not blog in your comments section but I'll say this: women who use their children as pawns are playing a losing game. Those women are immature, selfish and have no maternal instincts. Those women live up to the name "baby mama" and do nothing but perpetuate the stereotype of being a gold-digger and can only see dollar signs in their children instead of their potential.

I agree that their outlook is skewed depending on how they grew up. Having or not having a father definitely gives women a different view on things. But that's no excuse to continue acting like a child.

Great post, RDB.

4GOTTEN1 said...

I never understood using children as a pawn in relationships or post relationships to do or get what a person wants especially with women. Childrean are innocent and should be protected so why subject them to a bunch of bullshit that have nothing to deal with I just can't fathom why. I especially don't understand why women have babies on purpose to try and salvage a broken relationship. Some even scheme and plot to get pregnant by some men and when it doesn't work out they turn on the man and the child.
My father wasn't a really good father in fact he was a horrible father in my opinion. My mother still made sure we knew exactly who he by letting us spend time with him. We formed our own opinios about our father. She never in my entire life spoke ill of him. She definetly wasn't his biggest fan but she never let us know that. She kept their problems just that their problems they never became our problems. My father loved us and although he wasn't a good father he was a very decent man. Just something to think about.

Anonymous said...

This is gonna be all over the place but...I think in general most parents are selfish. I seriously believe that MOST parents have that "I brought you into this world, I can take you out" type of attitude, as if you owe them something for bringing you into this world. When no child is ASKED to be here. Most parents don't think about how the child's life could POSSIBLY be BEFORE they made the child and most parents don't try to make the best life possible for the child. Beyond material things. My father was a crackhead (Im not sensitive, its okay for people to know LOL) all my life. My mother still allowed him to see us when he popped back up whenever he felt like it. My mom still allowed him to see us time after time he'd broke promises and hurt us. My mom still allowed him to see us after he'd kidnapped us and held us hostage. She still allowed us to maintain a relationship with his family. The only reason I can see woman should be holding a child from their father is if there would be any harm done. Im still grateful for my mother because she allowed me to see what everything was with him. I never have to wonder. But yes, most parents say they love their kids because they are their children and they are supposed to. (My father told me he loved me ALL the time and Ive got some horrible stories) Especially if you are a mother. If you dont say its the best thing that happened to you in the world people will think you are crazy. When being honest prob would benefit the child more. Most kids arent planned. Therefore the best interest of the child is USUALLY not considered. I think its horrible for a woman to do that, considering the high number of fathers that don't care at all and wouldnt want real relationships with their children. To deprive a child of that that doesnt HAVE to go through it is cruel and you can't really love your children to do that. And even if you have grown up without a father and you turned out perfectly fine it seems odd. I don't think theres any woman that believes that they havent missed SOMETHING, even if they cant name exactly what that is. Additionally, I believe that the one thing that women are taught from birth (even if they are without fathers) that their ultimate goal in life is to "get and KEEP a man". Sometimes mothers turn bitter towards the children because they've painted a fairytale life with a man that they arent necessarily meant to be with. When their relationship with the man crumbles their relationships with their kids suffer if not completely crumble. It seems to me that kids are like a supplement and the man is the ultimate accomplishment...ESPECIALLY if he married you. LOL I dont think its really purposely hurting the child either. Most of these women are so busy trying to pay the man back that they don't see how they are affecting that child because that was not their initial focus from the time they got pregnant....

Aunt Jackie said...

If I recall correctly you were raised by your mother and you think that as a male/father that has had an affect on your point of view?

I tend to agree with bell hooks that women in toxic relationships are better served as single parents away from the toxicity than to partake in an abusive relationship.

When children see their mother's abused, verbally and/or physically it creates a myriad of social and emotional problems, and if the best resolve for the woman if to take her child and rebuild a healthy life...Mamma's Baby's, Daddy's Maybe.

If God had wanted it otherwise men would get pregnant and have periods and all the other good stuff that comes along with child birth.

Now granted I believe in family, and family to me means a mother and father working together, but life ain't always cut and dry..and although it's happened, I haven't heard many stories about abused men, so I can only use women as context.

Lex said...

But I also feel that women who grow up in homes with the father present would not do such, for they would have learned the value and love that a father or any parent would give under optimal circumstance.

I think that statement speaks volumes. I am not a mother, but I am a woman who is still her daddy's little girl. I was raised with the unconditional love of a father in a 2 parent household. As a girl, my father was the strongest, bravest, most powerful person in the world who had all the answers and everything I needed to feel secure. As a woman, I see his weaknesses, but that insight does not diminish what I perceived through a girls eyes. I learned what true love felt like. I learned what to hope for. I learned what was good and right and acceptable.

I can never imagine a woman who grew up with that kind of love intentionally depriving her own child(ren) of the same -- for any reason. Certainly not to spite a man.

I had a horrible marriage. We didn't have children. But when it ended it ended. We weren't good for each other so we made a clean break and went our separate ways. Though I was mistreated in many ways in that relationship, there's nothing to avenge. It's over. I've moved on and so has he. We are cordial now and even have a few pleasant moments once in a blue moon -- our relationship just didn't work. I don't know why couples can't just walk away without leaving carnage in the wake of a failed relationship.

The Jaded NYer said...

I also feel that women that do not "have such in the home do not see the importance of a man in the lives of children and may even be the type to say they don’t need a man."

I don't agree with that statement... the fact that my dad was such an ASS and did not play an active role in my life made me realize just the opposite.

JesseTheCat said...

Hello...well,in an ideal world eveyone would put their love for their children above all the petty fighting and squabbling with their ex partners.In my opinion,putting ones child above ALL else should be the normal thing for any parent!

However,we sure do not live in any sort of ideal world and though I have never had experience in what you have written about,I have seen it happening time and time again with couples who have split up.

To me its tragic that they are so filled with anger at each other that the child is often used as a pawn.I would never keep my child away from her father...unless he were a negative influence, such regularly using drugs and drinking and being irresponsible when taking care of her.Thankfully,her father is NOT like that...but if he were I would make sure he had NO access to her until he cleaned up his act.

My first priority wont be pettiness,it will simply be to protect the child .And I would expect the same treatment from him if I were behaving in a manner that was not good for my child.

Its a pity that so many parents are emotionally many aspects and experiences go into making them what they are..and using the kids as pawns is often the ONLY control they have left.When they do mature a bit,they may see all the mistakes they made...but by that time,the poor child is already affected and its often too late!
Wonderful and insightful post, you have a great talent with words...and are one Rockin' Blogger..keep it up :)

LovexHate said...

I think it's disgusting when parents do things like that because at the end of the day not only are they punishing their ex-partner but their own child as well! I can't understand how any parent in their right mind would even consider doing this as it clearly shows that they shouldn't even have children. It's just immature and evil to manipulate your own flesh and blood in such a way. The child's needs should come first above everything else.

Thanx for tipping me on to this blog, I really like it.

Miriam said...

Hi Torrence,

it was long over due but, just wanted you to know you're on my blog roll.

2sweetnsaxy said...

I believe it has everything to do with being utterly and completely selfish, not being able to step out of the picture to put someone else first, not even their own child. I've never understood using a child as a tool to get back at someone. That is someone stuck on "me".

How can you have any kind of successful relationship with anyone if you can't step outside of the "me" box?

C said...

I been reading your blog for a minute and you appear to have more eagle-like qualities than buzzard so please, please, please turn the sexism down a notch and stop pickin the carcass of that dead rhetoric about women w/out fathers not needing men,& strip clubs & rappers & poles & cash& such *sigh* you grew up w/o a father and you managed to stay out of prison/off the corner etc. & you actively love your babies;give women the same benefit of the doubt, damn! your mom obviously did what you seem to think many women can't/won't do though you have PROOF to the contrary.
are there women who do what you wrote about? yep both single & married and it's not just women. since you were speaking of yourself, I don't think there's a lot of mental stability with the woman in question based on what you've written in the past. but we've only gotten your side.yep some people do find it hard to separate personal feelings from what's best for the child and no matter how many laws we have in place, you can't regulate the heart/emotions w/ law. physical abuse is a no brainer, to keep the child away. most other things you have to just suck it up and let the child form their own opinions & enjoy the love of all who are willing to love them, dad & his family etc cause children have a right to love their parents, flaws & all. Having a daughter has made you more concerned about women's issues but will it ever make you thoroughly explore sexism from a woman's point of view & not the point of view you've decided that she 'should' have? IMO single moms & dads wearing them 'martyr' shoes brings out the worst in the other parent. context is hard to gage on the computer screen so understand that my questions, criticisms are RESPECTFUL albeit passionate debate & not judgement of you.

Blah Blah Blah said...

Why and how come people do the things they not something that can be supposed least something I can't...'cause I don't get it.
All of them are case by case situations...I guess. Have you asked your chick why she does the things she does?
And if we were reading her story, what would be your crime?

I can't fathom what kind of "parent" uses their child as bate or ransom... it's a bitch ass move on her and his matter how you look at it.

mocha said...

I think in most cases the child is the one that hurts the most...

Big Cheekz said...

I am a woman that grew up w/out a father and if something happend to my marriage - I would never deny my children the opportunity to still spend time w/their dad. I turned out ok but I did have issues because of my father not being around. Not only was he not in my life, but I only heard negative things about him while I was growing up. After I became an adult, I decided to try & find him. He died two weeks after I found out where he was & I never got to see him. So even as an adult, I never got to know him for myself. I envy my children because they have something I didn't while growing up. I would never want them to feel the way I did - like a part of me was missing. It saddens me that some women carry on this way, but lets not forget that some men will bash their "baby mamas" too, so the ignorance can go both ways. Parents that act like this don't realize what they are doing to their children. They don't get it until the child is grown & angry & the damage has been done.

msladydeborah said...

There are people who do not know how to fight.

They use whatever weapon is available.

I am not for using a child as a pawn period. I had a great living example~my mother.

My parents divorced when I was two. My dad re-married and moved to another city.

My mother never spoke ill of my dad in my presence. Nor did my grandparents. Whenever my dad came in town, there was no problem with him seeing me.

When I divorced, my ex was never denied access to our children. Even when he was not about the right thing.

That was really directed at me personally. So when we would have was on that level.

You were smart by signing papers. That gave you the proper inroad in your situation. There is a portion of the society that seems to forget, we still do legal business on paper and in B&W. But it is obvious that you loved your child enough to handle your business.

Loving folks is one of those things in life that is not easy. When it goes wrong~it hurts. A lot of emphasis gets placed on getting even for the personal pain. But not enough emphasis is placed on healing.

Torrance Stephens - All-Mi-T said...

sista gp
i Understand and know what u are going through and it was hard and I wil continue to be hard

Strange thing is I have always thought women were much stronger than men – physicality aside
And violence is never needed

Thank you

Well as it has been pointed out men are not immune from this. I have never heard a man say such.

U were blessed, I tell my kids such repeatedly through the day. And u were not all over the place

Aunt Jackie
Not a biological father but I had a step father. From about 8 up. So I did see that defined roll. Not to mention my uncle was the man of my house growing up before then and assumed that role after my grand father died. I only knew him for the first 3 yrs of my life but he was in the house too.

I don’t belive in babby momma or babby daddy. I will say childs mother or childs father. And u have never seen me use such – it implies disdain and lack of respect for the role to me and reduces it to surrogate.

Well said and wow.

The Jaded NYer
That’s good, but having one showed u what not to select meaning it helped u DEFINE expectations for the role. Which to me is the same thing

Thank u sister and do return and yep, the real world aint idea or a fairy tail but a lot of folks think so

I agree the child needs should be 1st as allll else agree, unless man is saying he is the devil.

Thanks how is life in Israel?

That is a great question, unless u look at we insteasd of I or me as I do. Family is a unit not a group of separate individuals isolated

OK, it was just an opinion. For I have said the same about men, that grow up wanting to be thugs and gangsters.
This is so true
you can't regulate the heart/emotions w/ law.
I think what u said was rather objective, we all have the ability to learn and see things differently.

Blah Blah Blah
Nope, my crime would be that she feels maybe powerless, and finds power maybe in hurting me – never asked, just the psychologisit in me. I know when ignore such and don’t get mad, it upsets her, that’s why I say the above

I agree

Big Cheekz
”I only heard negative things about him while I was growing up. After I became an adult, I decided to try & find him. He died two weeks after I found out where he was & I never got to see him. So even as an adult, I never got to know him for myself. I envy my children because they have something I didn't while growing up. I would never want them to feel the way I did - like a part of me was missing. ………WOW Thanks for sharing wish I could say more


ShAé - ShAé said...

People who scar children in order to make themselves feel better are scarred themselves. They are probably repeating a vicious cycle.

Anonymous said...

It has been suggested that lady Macbeth was actually a very weak character, & the speech she gives is actually a prayer that she become as strong as she needed to follow her husband's ambitions. This theory is bolstered in the text where she becomes mad & Macbeth does not. If you re-read her character w/this in mind, it becomes an even harsher/deeper play!

Marley said...

It's a shame that some women or even men for that matter use a child as a weapon to hurt the partner they've been hurt by. A lot of women are hurt when the father doesnt want to be in her life, but exclusively the childs life. Therefore the mother uses the child as a bait. If you dont want me, you cant have the child either. Not being able to seperate the needs of her child from her own hurt emotions. very sad.

Torie Michelle said...

In situations in which a relationship between parents has gone awry, the children often become pawns. I was a "pawn" for my father early on and from what I understand, it was a horrible time for my mother as he played Stratego or some crap with me.

I feel I'm much better off for having been sheltered from my father after the situation cooled off. He's done nothing for me; he hasn't really tried.

It seems that it's usually the man who engages in these antics, but I suppose women use children in this way as well. It's just much less talked, I don't know, female rapists.

What I do know for sure is that these situations are not about the children or love or anything like it. It's about the failed relationship and getting back at each other, which in twisted minds, takes precedence over the welfare of a child.

.::LADY MEL::. said...


p.s. your blogs are so insightful...i really didn't want to respond for fear of sounding inadequate. This is the first...I'll be back...each time, added more and more flair ;-)

Anonymous said...

Very interesting post. I actually have a male cousin that went through a very heart- wrenching situation trying to be a good father to his two young daughters after the relationship failed with his daughters' mother. After my cousin ended the relationship, she would often times use the children to push him into uncomfortable corners. As a man that was totally committed to being a good father and role model for his daughters, the actions of his ex-girlfriend would hurt him to the core, because she would pull for anything and everything to get the relationship back. Of course, the most popular threat that some woman use is the "I'm going to take your children away from you and you will never see them again," warning. This is totally unnecesary and un-called for if a man is actually "doing" what he is supposed to do as a father. Another thing that I didn't quite understand is how can a woman threaten to have a court order a man to pay child support, when he is "already" supporting his child emotionally and financially? If he is doing what he is supposed to do, then why do we have to get nasty and brutal about it? I don't have any children as of yet, so some may feel I don't have much weight to talk, but my concern is for all of our children, especially those in single parent homes. We should not use our children as bargaining tools. And please, please don't take a good, decent parent away from a child just because the you want the parent back in your romantic life. This ultimately hurts our children and that's very disheartening.


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